I am at work now. I went to leave and my 1982 R100RT with 56,000 miles won't start. It has not done this before. Actually, I have had airheads for 30 years and have not had something like this happen before, or have heard of something like this happening. When I push the starter, it gives one oomph and then does not turn over. First thought is dead battery, but the voltage shows good and the oomph is fairly strong. I had a coworker help me try to jump it just in case but no luck.
It is as if the engine does not want to turn. With it in gear on the center stand, I am not able to turn over the engine using the rear wheel. Off the center stand, I am not able to roll it forward in gear, although I could roll it back about a foot. After that, it turned over like a half before the oomph. The next step would be to remove the spark plugs to try again to make sure I was not fighting compression however it turns out the socket in my tool kit is not quite large enough to fit the spark plugs. Off the center stand, I am able to put it in gear, and then turn the rear wheel in neutral or with the clutch in.
Something strange did happen on the ride in this morning. It was running great. About a mile from work, there was a rapid clicking, much faster than the valves, similar to the rapid clicking the starter relay makes when the battery is too weak to start it. But I wasn't using the starter and was cruising along about 25mph. I pulled over and the sound stopped. I started up again and continued to work with no further problem.
Anyone have any idea what my problem might be?
Any chance you left the fuel tap(.)s open when you parked it? Even if you didn't, there's still a chance that one or both cylinders are full of fuel, and the engine won't rotate because the fuel is in the way. You'll need a spark plug wrench to remove both plugs, then with the bike in 3rd or 4th gear, rotate the engine with the back wheel and see if fuel comes out the spark plug holes. If it does, keep rotating the wheel until the fuel is pumped out. It would be a good idea to shine a flashlight down the spark plug holes and verify that the cylinder is empty.
More than likely, though, your battery is dead. How old is it? Most are shot before they get to five years old. You can test it by hooking a volt meter across the battery terminals and trying to start the bike. You should see more than 10 volts when cranking. Anything less indicates battery problems.
Could be oxidized/dirty battery terminals, too. Take the negative lead off the battery and use a wire brush or some sandpaper and clean the battery post and terminal on the ground wire. Leave the ground wire off, and do the same on the positive terminal and lead. Then disconnect the other end of the ground wire at the back of the transmission and clean that, too. Put the positive lead back on first, then the ground connections.
If the Bosch starter on your bike has been "upgraded" to an early Valeo starter, it could be that the magnets have come loose and jammed the armature in the magnet can. But that wouldn't have prevented the bike from bump starting.
The rapid clicking you mention could be a lot of things. Worst case you've dropped a valve or valve seat into the engine, and the piston is hitting it as it tries to rise. It could also be the starter relay or load shed relay freaking out because of a poor ground or very low battery voltage. It could even be a stick stuck in your spokes...
Check those things and let us know what you find...
First thought is dead battery, but the voltage shows good and the oomph is fairly strong. I had a coworker help me try to jump it just in case but no luck.
And just exactly what do you consider a good voltage ? Most people cannot take a battery voltage reading and get it right. Not because of any shortcoming of the person, but because of the way a battery behaves. You'd need to "load test" that battery due to surface charges within the battery.
This statement looks like useful information, but it's not. Details are missing.
It is as if the engine does not want to turn. With it in gear on the center stand, I am not able to turn over the engine using the rear wheel.
Which gear ? You don't have enough mechanical advantage to do this is 1st gear, but you would in 5th.
Again, this look like useful information, but the necessary details are missing.
Something strange did happen on the ride in this morning. It was running great. About a mile from work, there was a rapid clicking, much faster than the valves, similar to the rapid clicking the starter relay makes when the battery is too weak to start it. But I wasn't using the starter and was cruising along about 25mph.
• Check for raw fuel in the cylinders as Scot suggests. There may be something there.
• However, I believe the clicking was the starter relay or something within the starter throw-out system. I believe the clicking you heard was the starter trying to engage the moving flywheel. For some strange reason this was brought on by extended low speed running, which dis-charged the battery (because the engine was running with the headlamps ON at very low RPM). I have personal doubts about the true condition of your battery, proabably more due to, or at least in conjunction with, an aging charging system and poorly maintained battery cables. This would effect charging AND starting. Are you by any chance still running the OEM voltage regulator ? And is your headlamp bulb incandescent or LED ? If incandescent, what wattage ? And exactly which one of the 4 or 5 types of battery are in your bike, and what is its age ?
Actually, I have had airheads for 30 years and have not had something like this happen before....
And how many of those Airheads were 41 years old ? And tell me how many 41 year old cars and trucks did you see being driven on the way into work ? I say this to point out that you're no longer riding a "motorcycle". Your Airhead is now a "classic vehicle". You can no longer simply change the oil and consider that enough "preventive maintenance". Especially when the task is to behave like a modern commuter vehicle... which is proabably the toughest assignment any vehicle can have.
I think your bike may have been extremely trustworthy for continuous, long distance riding. This would have allowed full battery charging for extended periods at higher RPMs. Long-term charging would have negated the effect of "iffy" battery condition and questionable battery connections. I think what "tipped the kettle" was the change in riding assignments from cruiser to commuter duty... which is 10 or 20 times more difficult.
A 5 or 10 year old bike could have possibly made the switch, but the whole question about the level of preventive maintenance the bike has received would determine whether a 41 year old bike can make this leap.
Owning an old Airhead is easy.
Keeping an old Airhead running great is the true test.
Any chance you left the fuel tap(.)s open when you parked it?
Definitely not, but that would fit the pattern.
It would be a good idea to shine a flashlight down the spark plug holes and verify that the cylinder is empty.
I will do that.
And just exactly what do you consider a good voltage ?
The bike is in the parking lot at work now so I didn't have a separate voltmeter or other tools at the time. I will go back with the correct tools, although it will be easier once I figure out how to get it home. On the dashboard voltmeter, which reads low, it showed just below 12 before starting, which was comparable to my other airheads. It is dropping more than normal when I hit the starter, which can mean a bad cell, but I don't think it is in this case.
I have extensive experience with weak batteries. When I bought my first airhead, the hot battery lead was loose so it would charge but not very well. On this bike, a couple years ago when I was not riding a lot, I had a problem that I thought was a carb problem due to a rough idle but turned out to be my standalone battery charger was only putting out about 10 volts so I could not get enough of a charge to idle right. that really stumped me until I discovered the bad charger and used a different one. (I then replaced the battery.) In those cases, when the battery was weak, the starter would turn over weakly a few times and the dash voltmeter would not go up close to 12 when the bike was switched on.
In this case, it doesn't seem like the battery. The starter starts out vigorously, but stops half way through the first time. And then I used a co worker's jumper cables and car. With a weak battery, jumping from a car has always worked before.
Which gear?
Only second gear. I should have gone higher but I thought that was what I have used to turn it over in the past when adjusting the valves. (But maybe that was the R65 and R80, not the R100?)
However, I believe the clicking was the starter relay or something within the starter throw-out system. I believe the clicking you heard was the starter trying to engage the moving flywheel.
Maybe, but why would that happen?
For some strange reason this was brought on by extended low speed running, which dis-charged the battery (because the engine was running with the headlamps ON at very low RPM)
I wasn't really running at low speed. My trip to work is about 20 miles, with the last 5 miles being on a back roads with only a couple stop signs and no traffic. The speed limit is only 30 on those last 5 miles, but I keep in a lower gear so the RPMs stay over 3000. But before that the speed limit is 40 or 50 and not that many lights or stop signs.
But maybe my charging system is not great? The battery connections are good. I think this bike sat at some time in it's history. A month or two ago, I took apart the instrument cluster because I thought a bulb was out, but it turned out to be a fair amount of corrosion where the bulbs contacted the strip. I cleaned that up and the bulbs were much brighter.
Check for raw fuel in the cylinders as Scot suggests.
I will do that.
Are you by any chance still running the OEM voltage regulator?
Could be. I have only had this bike for about 6 years and have not changed it.
And is your headlamp bulb incandescent or LED?
Incandescent
If incandescent, what wattage?
55/60
And exactly which one of the 4 or 5 types of battery are in your bike, and what is its age?
It is one of the sealed absorbed gas mat types, about 2 years old. I am aware that when they die, they die more quickly than the slosh batteries.
Thanks for helping me think through this issue.
And exactly which one of the 4 or 5 types of battery are in your bike, and what is its age?
Found the receipt: It is a Caltric AGM battery purchased Sept 2019.
And exactly which one of the 4 or 5 types of battery are in your bike, and what is its age?
Found the receipt: It is a Caltric AGM battery purchased Sept 2019.
• So out of seven VERY serious questions, you can answer only one ? The "devil is in the details" and without details I can't help you.
• Question No. 8: Did you replace your OEM voltage regulator with one specifically for AGM batteries ? AGM batteries require a higher rate of charge, which is controlled by the Voltage Regulator.
Owning an old Airhead is easy.
Keeping an old Airhead running great is the true test.
The bike is home now. I have not done much yet. I pulled the spark plugs and tried to rotate the engine via the rear wheel. It reaches a point where there is a hard stop. I can go back part way. Definitely not a battery or charging problem. Fishing with a magnet through the spark plug hole, in the right cylinder I found this ring which seems to be the valve seat? I don't know if they are original or have been redone at some point (I have only had the bike about 5 years.) In my airhead wrenching experience I haven't been inside the cylinders before so I am not sure of next steps. I suppose I need to remove the head and look inside? It seems like at minimum I will need to have the heads redone? (Would I need to have both done so they match?) Where are people getting their heads done these days? Am I likely to find the pistons or cylinders are trashed as well? Or are used ones the way to go instead of fixing these (but then are there differences by year? Would I probably just get more valves that are on their way out?) Sorry for so many questions.
That looks like part of a valve seat to me. The only way to assess just how bad things have gone would be to dismantle that suspect cylinder for a visual inspection.
former Airmarshal, IL.
That looks like part of a valve seat to me. The only way to assess just how bad things have gone would be to dismantle that suspect cylinder for a visual inspection.
I concur.
Owning an old Airhead is easy.
Keeping an old Airhead running great is the true test.
I took the head off and found the remaining pieces of the valve seat. Here are pictures of the head and the piston as I found them. I don't see any damage to the cylinder wall. The piston has a two larger gouges and a smaller gouge, as well as an impression of a piece of the seat. The head has small gouges on the edge of where the valve seat goes, as well as an impression of a piece of the seat. I am supposing they are not repairable? What options do I have?
Also, is it correct that this would have been caused by a bad or improperly installed valve seat, not by some other problem that I would only discover after the jug was fixed?
The piston is OK and should be used as is.
You will need a complete cylinder head replacement with a good/used cyl head.
Owning an old Airhead is easy.
Keeping an old Airhead running great is the true test.
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